#45 Feeding Baby: Breastfeeding and Beyond
Mackenzie Jones
Thank you for joining us for this episode of talking health in the 406 where we are one community under the Big Sky I'm your host mackenzie Jones the program manager of the DPHHS Montana disability and health program which supports the disability community and developing healthy and accessible communities. I am very excited to talk with our guests today about breastfeeding in Montana the health benefits of breastfeeding and where to go for resources and support no matter your situation. Sure. We have with us today Jessica keckley and Terry Miller with the nutrition and physical activity program at DPHS as well as leasing little and Nicole Bullock with Wick I will let them introduce themselves fully describing their professional role and their connection to breastfeeding. I am really excited to have you all here today because there are so many of us online I want to make. Sure that we. All get a chance to introduce ourselves so if you take a moment to introduce yourself what is your professional role and what is your connection to breastfeeding.
Jessica Kechely
Hi my name is Jessica Keckley and I am a program specialist in the Department of Public Health and Human services here in Montana. Specifically I work within the nutrition and physical activity program and I'm really excited to be able to work alongside all of these great team members to support breastfeeding in Montana will through promoting policy as well as a variety of different initiatives that we'll talk through today.
Terry Miller
Hi I'm Terry Miller I am the senior breastfeeding consultant for the Montana nutrition and physical activity program and I get to wear many different breastfeeding hats across Montana in terms of breast feeding support education promotion and protection.
Nicole Bulik
Hi I am Nicole Bulik I am the breastfeeding coordinator for the state of Montana WIC program so I get to wear the hat in supporting our local agencies with breastfeeding and overseeing our breastfeeding peer counselor programs.
Lacey Little
And I'm Lacy Little I am the state work director so my role was breastfeeding is I help Nicole and and help give her her tools and resources she needs to run her care counseling program.
Mackenzie Jones
Thank you and WIC stands for women infant and children right.
Lacey Little
Yeah so our technical program title is the special supplemental nutrition program for women infants and children while are better known as WIC.
Mackenzie Jones
In total a little bit more about what WIC is specifically and who it supports.
Lacey Little
WIC is a nutritional program but it provides nutrition education which is a big piece where a preventative program we also provide referrals to different community resources that people may need in in their local area whether it be mental health or food bank networks or even where to find a dentist that takes Medicaid. We also provide nutrition through our food package where a supplemental programs we provide about 70% of. Someone 's needs.
Most.
Lacey Little
Based on really specific nutrients and so our population we serve is birth up until they turn 5 and then we serve pregnant people and postpartum people up depending on their breastfeeding status up to a year if they're fully breastfeeding and 6 months if they are postpartum on this.
And then we also serve a lot of foster care children so we have a lot of grandparents and foster families and single family or single parents raising children too and we support that as.
Mackenzie Jones
Well so I was told that it is a national breastfeeding month this August tell me about the theme. The 2025 and how your work supports these efforts.
Terry Miller
Happy world breastfeeding week and US breastfeeding month it's August so every year the first 7 days the world celebrates breastfeeding in all its forms and what it does is it aims to highlight the benefits of breastfeeding and maternal care every year. They have a theme and this theme is breastfeed to support a sustainable environment. And how we can breastfeed and increase environmental protections so basically breastfeeding uses no packaging also uses very little transportation breastfeeding is free uses hardly any water and. Also breastfeeding uses no dairy cows so breastfeeding is just more environmentally sustainable. For all of us.
Jessica Kechely
We just did one a note that breastfeeding can be challenging when parents are not fully supported so that's another goal is to provide that full support.
Mackenzie Jones
So I've heard a lot.
Terry Miller
About baby friendly hospitals what is a baby friendly hospital and how do they support breastfeeding mothers the baby friendly hospital initiative is an initiative that started in the 1970s 1980s through the World Health Organization and UNICEF and it's an international reco. Mission and it recognizes hospitals that do and perform the best practices in infant nutrition in care and often it takes hospitals around 4 years learning educating and implementing these practices to be officially recognized as baby friendly so that is what a baby friendly. Hospital is we are lucky to have 6 baby friendly hospitals in Montana anywhere from a small hospitals like Bitterroot health to larger hospitals like Saint Peters and Saint Vincent 's so like I said the baby friendly hospital initiative just works with hospitals. To help them support breastfeeding with their with their families.
Mackenzie Jones
How does a hospital become baby friendly who do they?
Terry Miller
Contact what kind of steps do they go through in order to get that certification or designation all that's that's a great question so how hospitals become baby friendly are they work with baby friendly USA which is a nonprofit national organization. And they work with the hospital they also work with us at the Montana nutrition and physical activity program if they're with Montana and we provide the technical steps for hospitals to work through there's 4 phases to work through the the different policies and regulations to become baby friendly. So what they follow is the 10 steps to breastfeeding and those 10 steps would be educating all labor and delivery staff about how to teach breastfeeding another step would be to. So promote all infant care in the in the room in the in the room with the mom and baby so you're not removing baby from the the room so mom 's going to learn and what. About baby and. Feeding cues another step would be on discharge would be to provide all the information. One breast in the education resources in their community so those are about 3 of the 10 steps and deliverables at each hospital has to undertake to become baby friendly designated so it's a lot. Work every 5 years they have to go through different plans to get redesignated and yeah it's a lot of work to and they really amazing recognition to become baby family designated.
Mackenzie Jones
And you mentioned there are 6 baby friendly designated hospitals in Montana how does someone find out if their local hospital is designated as baby friendly what I would do is go to the baby friendly USA website baby friendly USA.
Terry Miller
And there is a look here on there you type in your your zip code and you can tell you all the hospitals that are baby friendly within your area right now we have Saint Vincent Livingston Saint Peters. We're valley. Marcus steely whitefish Logan and I'm missing one.
Jessica Kechely
The Community Hospital of Anaconda.
Terry Miller
That's it yeah the Community Hospital of Anaconda is our longest baby friendly designated hospital I believe they've been baby friendly designated for 25 years. 20 to 25 years. That's incredible yeah they do amazing work in Anaconda we're really excited to partner with them.
Mackenzie Jones
Thank you for sharing those those 6 hospitals and as a follow up when I.
Jessica Kechely
Hospital isn't designated what resources are available for pregnant women are pregnant people in the community and how do you connect to those resources I just wanted to make it of note that just because the hospital isn't designated as baby friendly doesn't mean they don't have any of those supports in place. At a baby friendly hospital would it could mean that they were working towards baby friendly designation. And so it doesn't mean that they're not supporting breastfeeding mothers it just means that they haven't got that intensive designation so I did what just wanna note that first of all so in addition to baby friendly hospitals there are other ways that both the community and workplaces. Can support? Lactating individuals within worksites across Montana we do have a mother friendly worksite initiate. Have? Which supports businesses in providing a private space uh flexible policy for break times and a policy that's steep space and time to express breast milk are available to employees this does tie back to? Montana policies that protect the rights of mothers to be able to breastfeed in public and have those. Supports in the workplace and the nutrition and physical activity program is here to support any facilities that were are interested in becoming mother friendly designated just wanted to note that mothers are some of the fastest growing segments of the US workforce with 1/3 of mothers are trained to work within 3 months after birth. So breastfeeding support from an employer can help reduce barriers and other encounters when returning to work.
Mackenzie Jones
Thanks Jessica and I'm going. To ask the WIC folks Lacey and Nicole.
Lacey Little
If mothers that qualify for your programs where can they go to access services there are mothers that may seem eligible for our program if they're on Medicaid snap tennis FPR you know flurry of eligibility program? They can go ahead and they can actually go to our website if they want and there's a sign up with.com and they can type in there's a code and it'll give them the nearest clinic to them not all of our agencies have a breastfeeding peer counseling program but all of our agencies have staff that are breast that have breastfeeding training and they do have breast feeding coordinators. And and and you think like that. So we have been working very closely to get our breastfeeding services spread out across the state by asking some of our larger agencies to supply breastfeeding for counseling services to some of our smaller communities so that we can still continue to reach all the families that we can but the quickest way to get to our services is. To visit our website and then they can type in their zip code to see where the nearest clinic is to them.
Mackenzie Jones
Thanks Lacey and I have heard of the resource zip milk where someone who's breastfeeding can type in their zip code and access resources is that available in Montana.
Terry Miller
Yes the milk is available in Montana and it's really simple so you just go onto zip milk website and you can either search by state or you can search by your zip code you put in your zip code and it brings up breastfeeding resources that are available within your area whatever that area might be. And these can be local WIC offices breastfeeding classes from your local health department it could be a private lactation provider and it just has that information on how to contact them. So that would be zip milk and it's a great resource especially in Montana where especially in our rural areas that might be harder to find lactation support.
Mackenzie Jones
Thanks Terry a follow up question to your conversation about a mother from the work sites is there a way to know if your work site is mother from me or a website they can go to to encourage their work site to become mother. Only.
Jessica Kechely
Yes so the Montana nutrition and physical activity website does have a list of designated mother friendly work sites so you can check that out on there that does not mean that your work site is not mother friendly by any means and we do encourage you to talk directly with your employer. As I mentioned there are policies that support individuals who want to. Expressed breast milk so there is a Montana code nursing mother and infant protection so in this code the Montana legislature later finds that breast feeding a baby is an important basic act of nurturing that must be protected in the interests of maternal and child health and family values. So a mother has the right to breastfeed and the mother 's child in any location public or private where the mother and child are otherwise authorized to be present. So knowing that rate is really important whether the mother is covered or not is also covered in this annotated code there's another Montana code for public employers this policy is on unlawful discrimination and states that all States and county government municipalities. School districts and the university system must have a written policy supporting women who want to continue to breastfeed after returning from maternity leave. And it is unlawful to refuse to hire employee or bar or to discharge an employee. Who expresses milk in the workplace or to discriminate against an employee? Who expresses not in the workplace and compensation or in? Terms. Conditions or privileges of employment unless based upon a bona fide occupational qualification essentially there are codes that protect individuals who wish to breastfeed and the workplace and I encourage you to we will follow up with those after the. Podcast and you can check out those resources and always contact the nutrition and physical activity program if you have any questions about your breastfeeding rights in Montana.
Terry Miller
And you might have mentioned this Jessica that just in case also the Affordable Care Act has the lactation accommodation law so basically it's a law for all employers across the US where they need to provide a space for an employee to pump that's not a bathroom and time for a. Employee to pump during their breaks and they have to provide. That for up to one. Year so that is actually a national law and most employee employers can easily offer that in their at their work sites and if you do that if you have a place if you have a place to pump for moms and it's not a bathroom it's private and have a policy which is kind of our Montana twist on it. And you provide that and you outreach to the map program we can easily designate you as a mother friendly worksite and what you get is a mother friendly worksite you asked well what you receive is recognition on our macro website as another friendly works. You also receive a certificate and a a decal you can put on your door or your your business to notify everyone that you are mother friendly and you are providing those supports so we have you happy to recognize any work site in Montana as mother friendly and.
Mackenzie Jones
As a follow up. For any work sites that may need additional financial support are in rural areas or tribal communities is there funding for them to apply for in order to help them to become a mother friendly
Terry Miller
That's a great question and there isn't funding but we do provide free Technical Support so say you're like ohh how do we set up that what do we have in our office that we can make into a private space and we could we will work with that employee employer to make that happen whether we can actually we can retrofit a broom closet. Done that before we have we have worked with the managers office and we made that manager 's office locked and that can be used for an employee that needs to rescue the manager would just leave during the break hours we've actually. Then how people order different like a tent that they could bring into their their coffee shop area outside that they could provide for a lactation space so we we we do all that for free we can also help provide policy templates to set up the lactation policy and we. Like I said we do all of that free of charge so we don't have any scholarships or grants per say but we will work with every work site to make it happen for them.
Mackenzie Jones
Thank you Terry.
Jessica Kechely
So just as far as rural areas go in Montana we know how Montana has a lot of rural communities and we do support the training of individuals who wish to become lactation specialists across Montana and specifically in rural areas and so even if you. And just need that extra support on that side of things we can help to put you in contact with lactation specialist if that is of. Just if they're not available in your area as well we can do something like virtually as well we can help to set that up so there are a lot of really great supports that we can make happen just knowing that those are out there and that we're happy to put you in contact with those is a. Great first step.
Mackenzie Jones
Thanks Jessica and that was a good segue into a question about certified lactation specialists are there different levels of certification and what kind of training goes into those different levels.
Terry Miller
Well there are many different levels of lactation specialists and it kind of depending on what region you're in on whether it's East Coast the West Coast or central you might have different names for each qualification so the highest level of lactation certification is called an international board certified. Lactation consultant also known as an ibclc. And that is kind of the gold level in credentialing it requires years of actual direct lactation work with families it requires advanced level education classes in college like nutrition and anatomy and Physiology and. Also it requires like lactation specific education so a lot of times a lot of nurses or people that are in that healthcare field. Have an easier way of becoming I BCLC kind of the next level down is a certified lactation counselor a CLC that's what they're known as in Montana and they're kind of our area they also could be known as LC 's lactation counselors or lactation specialists but for Montana we seem to have a lot of CLC 's now it is a 90? Our course on lactation education specifics from anatomy working with breastfeeding moms that requires you to take some competencies and also an examination at. The end in Montana right now we're running between 150 to 200 CLC 's we used to have more during the pandemic we kind of saw a drop in just CLC credentialing overall but we do happen to have per capita the greatest amount of CLC 's in the US. And we like Jessica said we do offer with partnership with the Montana Hospital Association CLC scholarships for rural hospitals community access hospitals and it's a great program I think we have awarded over 100 CLC scholarships. Date for our hospital hospital partners to become CLC 's peer counseling that's in there too yeah let's let's talk about the peer counseling program how did that get started who can be counselors.
Nicole Bulik
So for the quick care counselor programs the local agencies have to apply for the program and I believe we have. 15 local agencies right now that do have the peer counselor program. And our peers are people who usually have they fit the pure scope I should say so they. Usually are same age range as I participants usually from within the community they have also been like participants in the past or currently themselves they do have breastfeeding experiences. Well we do not want our peer counselors to have credentials such as healthcare providers or anything like that if they are going to go on and get their certified lactation counselor certificates or anything like that we want to move them into a different role within wig. But our peer counselors are there to support our breastfeeding Mamas who are expressing breast milk for their infants whether that be pumping nursing any any form. And so they they usually have had that best reading experience themselves.
Mackenzie Jones
Thanks to Nicole, Lacey would you add anything more to the program.
Lacey Little
I would just say that the breastfeeding peer counseling program is is newer to the WIC world it was started in the early 2000s and it's been a program that has continued to grow for the most part and as Nicole said we do have 15 agencies when Terry was talking about CLC 's and IV CLC 's. Montana WIC program has been trying to encourage and support staff. When appropriate where they can stay within their scope to to get those certifications and so you know we definitely can see between our program and and their program continuation of services and as the continued support for bus feeding services in Montana?
Mackenzie Jones
In addition to the peer counseling I also saw on your website. Description of the Montana breastfeeding coalition and breastfeeding learning collaborative can you describe the difference of those 2.
Terry Miller
The breastfeeding learning collaborative is our annual breastfeeding nutrition conference that we hold every year usually in the spring and it is facilitated by both the Napa program the nutrition and physical activity program and WIC and it has been a wonderful partnership. I believe we're going on our 15th annual collaborative our last collaborative was held last month or in may and we had almost 200. Good health care perinatal providers and supporters from across the Montana and also from I think we had some from Texas it's getting known as a really robust and educational conference and we bring in speakers from all over the US and also local speakers. To talk about current evidence based practices in breastfeeding and infant nutrition and maternal care and the breastfeeding coalition is a coalition. Of like minded breastfeeding organizations that support breastfeeding whether that be WIC healthcare providers the the Napa program and it's just a loosely based coalition that tries to bring in organizations that support infant nutrition.
Mackenzie Jones
So this is a podcast talking health and the 406 which is aimed at sharing stories around health and community health and Montana and really thinking about chronic disease prevention and health promotion. Today we've talked. A lot about breastfeeding within the healthcare system in supporting mothers. Through our public health programs but what are the specific health benefits of breastfeeding for a mom and a baby.
Jessica Kechely
Breast milk is one of the best sources of nutrition for most babies as the babies grow the mothers breast milk also changes to meet that baby's needs which is really unique the breast milk shares antibodies from the mother to the baby and these can help babies develop a strong immune system and protect them from illnesses breastfeeding has a lot of health benefits. To the mother and for the baby can also help to reduce mother's risk of breast and ovarian cancer type 2 diabetes and high blood pressure. Where and for the baby those who are breastfed have a lower risk of asthma obesity type one diabetes severe lower respiratory disease ear infections sudden infant death syndrome otherwise known as SIDS and gastrointestinal infections like diarrhea and vomiting? As well as necrotizing enterocolitis or NEC.
Terry Miller
I can share a little story about working with a new mom first time mom on on breastfeeding and I think I was her 3rd lactation counselor she had seen she was having a real tricky time getting the latch down and also producing enough milk and we you know as. As I was her 3rd lactation consultant we were still looking for that golden nugget that one thing that would make it all work and sometimes breastfeeding can trick be really tricky and it can put a lot of pressure on moms to do to do it right make it work. And we weren't finding that that that right thing to make it all happen and this mom was getting tired and exhausted and what we decided was. We decided to change the expectation. Breastfeeding or the active breastfeeding brings a lot of benefits you don't actually have to have that milk transfer taking place what we can do is something called skin to skin and we can do skin to skin whether you're bottle feeding formula bottle feeding pumped breast milk or breast feeding and what is skin to skin. Skin to skin is babies. Chest on mom 's chest just it is as easy as it sounds skin to skin and what the skin to skin do it regulates babies body temperature which is especially crucial for for preterm babies it reduces the infant stress rate by regulating that infants heart rate and breathing rate this is just basic skin to skin. It enables colonization of friendly moms friendly bacteria from mom skin to baby skin which reduces infections it promotes bonding baby and mom emotional connection and attachment and it teaches moms feeding cues those. Hughes when babies are just opening their eyes that's great time to feed baby whether it's breastfeeding or bottle feeding and also promotes the release of feel good hormones so we can do all of these amazing. Benefits for baby and mom. Without actually breastfeeding but by doing skin to skin which you can also do by bottle feeding. So sometimes moms might not be able to reach their breastfeeding goals and there can be a lot of guilt with that but we can change that expectation and make sure we're teaching the benefits of all the other important parts of just attaching with your baby because we never want to make moms feel really guilty about not making everything happen. So I think that sometimes we can really promote all the great parts of of caring for a baby and the great parts of breastfeeding bite skin to skin and also other family members can do it dads can do skin to skin so I just wanted to. Share.
Mackenzie Jones
That like you said it's really important to be supportive of all. Mothers and parents and understanding where they are AT and coming up with strategies that support their health and the baby 's health as much as possible no matter what that looks like.
Terry Miller
What we know now is that 60% of mothers are not reaching their breastfeeding goals? Whether that breastfeeding goal would be one week one month or one year so I feel that our our programs should be focused on not looking at making sure moms are breastfeeding for the American Academy of Pediatrics recommends breastfeeding exclusively. For 6 months and then followed by breastfeeding and complementary foods for a year and then breastfeeding for 2 years. Years and beyond as long as mutually desired and that is a lot if you are a mom and baby and family and it's the first few nights of breastfeeding and you're seeing that I got to do this for 2 years or a year it can be really overwhelming so I really we really try to focus on our programs. It meets moms where they're at wherever they're breastfeeding goals are one week one month one year wherever it's that we try to focus on that and not focusing on those tick boxes of what they're supposed to do. 

Lacey Litte
I just want to echo at Terry said right you know and and Wick we we talk with our families about what are your breastfeeding goals so we really try to be there and being encouraging for whatever their goals may be and they may change and that's what we are here to do is to help support and so you know. Like Terry said whether it's one week one day you know a month you know I think everybody is here to just try and support for whatever their journey may.
Mackenzie Jones
In addition to supporting breastfeeding moms through WIC do you have programs that support or provide. Financial support in order to get formula or other forms of food for the babies.
Lacey Little
So in our program we do provide formula for moms that choose not to breastfeed that is just a standard part of our program. They get us again we're supplemental so it's not 100% of their needs and so if we have families saying that they need additional assistance we will guide them to resources in their communities that might be able to help our locals are amazing and they know all the tips and tricks for their communities and so. The family can just reach out to their local clinic and they will help try and connect them to whatever opportunities might be in their area. We do have a lot of kiddos that may be on specialty formula for one reason or another and we will work with those families as long as it meets all regulation requirements to to help get formula specialty formula shipped which can help alleviate some of that financial burden because you know we all know specialty. Really pretty expensive.
Mackenzie Jones
I'm thinking more about the health benefits of breastfeeding I have heard the phrase when thinking about tribal efforts and tribal communities milk is medicine I know we don't have a tribal or indigenous representative with us today but I did want to.
Ask about milk. Is medicine and whether you know of resources where tribal communities or indigenous people can go we did a podcast with Amy stiffarm and people can go and listen to that podcast about her experience with breastfeeding as an indigenous woman? Terry do you have any thoughts about other resources for indigenous mothers.
Terry Miller
Yes I do so milk medicine looks at breastfeeding through more of a holistic perspective and I would encourage anyone any of our our tribal communities that are interested in looking at nook medicine to look at the milk medicine collective. It is kind of steered by Amy echohawk. And it is where indigenous milk medicine collective envisions a world where indigenous communities are transformed and uplifted with access to the tradition and knowledge of milk medicine and that is with the milk medicine collective and I highly encourage anyone to go to that to that website and learn more.
Mackenzie Jones
Another phrase that I've heard is liquid gold or breast milk has been called liquid gold to emphasize its value. You have mentioned many health benefits you've also mentioned environmental benefits of breastfeeding for the mom and baby and the communities we live in are there other benefits to breastfeeding what what makes it liquid gold.
Jessica Kechely
Speaking to breast milk as being liquid gold is that it is rich in nutrients and antibodies and growth factors that are crucial for newborns development and immune systems I think also it can it can be difficult as we have heard a little bit about to for everyone to best feed so it's a high demand. As well.
Terry Miller
Right with breast milk why it's called liquid gold is like Jessica said there's so many benefits that you cannot replicate and duplicate you cannot no matter how hard companies try they can't get those live ingredients that breast milk provides it is breast milk is so important. That especially for preemies that hospitals actually. Purchase donated breast milk from the human milk banking association to give to their preemies and several hospitals are doing it across Montana because in premies on donated breast milk drive they are healthier and are discharged earlier it is so. Valuable that human milk bakes and there's like several across or quite a few across the United states what they do is they take donated. Milk from mothers that have a have an excess and they actually interview the mothers to make sure they have struck good health backgrounds they take it they process it they sterilize the milk and then they actually sell that breast milk back to hospitals and that an ounce of breast milk. Can cost between 4 and $6.00 per ounce when we talk about? Like how much is breast milk so if you were to purchase it between 4 to $6.00 for an. Ounce of breast. Milk right and we're thinking that babies can take 3 to 4 ounces depending how old they are per 5 ounces sometimes 6 ounces per setting images that cost adds up so we can look at the human benefits of breast milk. All the health benefits for moms and babies and the community and the environment but also the cost of it is because it's so helpful and so valuable.
Mackenzie Jones
And so you talked about. What milk sharing practices in the formal practice of giving to to donors and then pasteurizing the milk and then selling it back to the hospitals in order to give to to mothers at the hospital are there informal ways can anyone share milk? Back and forth what are the the risks of that.
Terry Miller
Informal milk sharing is the sharing of milk not through a certified human milk bank organization and informal milk sharing can look many ways it can between friend to friend they're like I have some extra milk in the fridge my newborn do you want some. It can be and there's also kind of also can be on the Internet saying I need milk there can actually be collectives where it might be like a Facebook page where people are sharing milk that way but informal milk sharing does come with risks. We can look at the risks of the transfer of diseases that the donor might have also are they taking medications how is that breast milk handled so informal milk sharing is very it can be risky if you go to the Academy of breastfeeding medicine. They have a policy on informal milk sharing and and how organizations and can do it safely and effectively but right now because of the unknown and the risk we can't condone informal milk sharing.
Mackenzie Jones
Earlier Jessica mentioned there are other things you can do with milk so sometimes like regular cows milk in the fridge it goes bad or maybe the mother was sick. What are other ways you can still use this valuable breast milk in order to support the health of the baby?
Terry Miller
The baby well just to clarify if a mother is sick so she has a cold or. Or you know. The flu she still can breastfeed her baby and she should because at that moment that mom becomes sick she starts making antibodies to fight that sickness and so she passes those antibodies. While she breastfeeds to her beauty so the chances of her baby getting that illness are less or not at all so in many most situations mom can breastfeed when they're sick there are certain parts where if moms has lesions on her breast if she's taking certain very few medications. There's not a lot you can still mostly breastfeed through them that a mom can't breastfeed but just wanted to make sure that if a mom sticks you can still breastfeed in fact you're actually doing your baby good does breast milk go bad and if it does how can you still use it wow breast milk can't go bad there are certain storage. Guidelines you want to keep it in a freezer you don't want it you want to default there's certain ways you need to thaw breast milk and once it's out and about. After it's thawed it can only stay at room temperature for a certain amount of time so sometimes you do have to get rid of breast milk which is so hard to put when you after your mom. Is pumped all? That to pour it down the drain but there are after like like regular milk it can it can go bad. After a while it's pretty it's pretty shelf stable breast milk but there is. A. A amount of time that you can't use it especially the babies using it through a bottle and they take a sip of the breast milk or formula through the bottle and then you leave it you can't let sit around because that bacteria does transferred from the baby 's mouth into the bottle.
Mackenzie Jones
A question for Lacey and Nicole in the hospitals where WIC with the clinics where WIC is providing breastfeeding support are most of those certified lactation counselors are they. Peer counselors what does that look.
Lacy Little
Though most of our work clinics are actually public health departments we do have a couple of agencies that maybe hospitals or other health facilities in those communities but the majority of them are public health departments so we don't generally provide services like in hospitals what we do is. Have them come into the program make sure they're certified and and get support from our? Staff a lot of our staff do have CLC 's because we do we do support that and actually when we have funding available we reach out to staff that do not have their CLC 's and ask if they are interested in taking the course and we do a lot of additional support and education around breastfeeding. As Terry talked. About we coordinate with them with the breastfeeding learning collaborative. And then you know this year we had 8080 some staff of our 140 so we actually get the majority of our staff to attend a lot of the different breastfeeding trainings but most of our support is through our wit clinics without resting peer counselors they generally do that through text messages or through phones. There are secure platform with our moms or with our families and that can be an off hours on weekends but again it's still those services are still provided through our actual WIC clinics.
Mackenzie Jones
Terry you shared a story. Earlier received the call is the story you would like to share about the success of WIC or providing services to someone.
Lacey Little
Sure I'd be happy to share uh we actually had a I think it was in 2017 or 2019 we had a short video made of a family. Up in up on the western side of the state that talked about how without Wick she wouldn't have been able to make it in through nursing was through her nursing school and not with the help of the lactation counselors and the WIC program she had the support she needed to be able to finish her degree. Becoming the person so that video is kind of sticks with me and you know when I. When you have? Your hard days it's always fun to kind of pull it up and and watch them and and just remember why you do what you do to support the families. 

Terry Miller
So I remember when I had my first born I was pregnant I am kind of a keener I read everything I could about breastfeeding I was a breastfeeding guru I was actually more worried about the breastfeeding experience from just all the what I'd heard that. Actually the birthing experience and and as I've grown in this profession I realize that that's actually not uncommon from for families and moms to be more nervous about breastfeeding just because of the stories they've. So go to the hospital have my baby and I'm prepared with all this knowledge book knowledge and breastfeeding was really really difficult there are just many different reasons my baby was a little a little sick she had a really low heart rate and low respiration. So she couldn't just kind of figure out all the breastfeeding. Stuff to go to latch on I I had some issues and I remember feeling at the time that this was the first thing I should do for my baby and I. Couldn't do it. I couldn't do the very first thing to be a good mom and as I have grown on in this profession. They said I've heard that again and again so I decided you know what. I decided like there there wasn't a lot of help at the time and I decided to go be the change that you want to see in the world and I said you know what I'm going to go become a certified lactation counselor and I became a certified lactation counselor and then I said you know what I'm going to work for our local WIC department and did that and then I became an IPCC and now I get to work with breastfeeding. UM. Families across the across the state it's like one of the greatest honors of my life and I want to say Fast forward that was 19 years ago my baby was breastfed and bottle fed and now she's almost like she's 19 turning 20 and this bottle fed baby is very smart going to an amazing school. And she was on formula and all the worries that I had back then for bottle feeding we did not come to fruition and I want to say that they're now there are so many more resources for our families in Montana there are so many more whether that is in the health departments at the WIC offices at their hospitals online. Tell the health services there are so many more resources available for moms and with that currently in Montana 's breastfeeding initiation rate is up there is that 90 over 90% and and that's just through all the amazing work that our organizations are doing across the state.
Mackenzie Jones
Thank you for sharing that Terry and for. Being vulnerable with us today we. We know that these stories are really powerful for our listeners so we appreciate hearing those those real words from you and how that led to your your career and what you love to do today.
Jessica Kechely
I wanted to take a chance to tie back to I know we started off talking about world breastfeeding month and week and the topic being. Environment and I wanted to speak to that as in creating a breastfeeding friendly environment also includes all of the different levels so you have the national the health level the workplace the community and if. Anything has gotten out of this podcast I hope individuals realize that there are resources out there and to support individuals who wish to to breastfeed and even if your first experience isn't you know ideal there are additional resources out there and. Personally I know individuals who with their first child they struggle but. They learned overtime that there were additional resources in place that could help them and they were able to later successfully breastfeed. Additional children that they had so just knowing that those resources are out there and being open to reaching out and I think it's something that I really hope individuals are able to take away from this.
Mackenzie Jones
Thank you for listening to the talking health and the 406 podcast where we are one community under the Big Sky I am your host mackenzie Jones we'd like to thank our guests Jessica keckley and Terry Miller with the nutrition and physical activity program and Lacey little and Nicole Bullock with Montana Wick for sharing their experience and expertise with us. If you would like more information on what you heard today visit our website at talking health in the406.nt.gov if you haven't already Please remember to rate review and subscribe thank you and have a wonderful rest of your day?